Re: [Audacity-quality] Start / End / Centre / Length

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Re: [Audacity-quality] Start / End / Centre / Length

James Crook
Peter,

It's work in progress.  The title and chevrons are clickable.  The indication that they are clickable is currently missing, and clearly essential.

Now that I've told you that the title and the chevrons are clickable, try them out.

More details, if you want, here in comment #19.
http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1630

There are several possible directions it could go from here.  It's obviously vital that users can see this is clickable, e.g. using button styling.  I am taking on board your comments.

--James.





On 5/29/2017 10:56 AM, Peter Sampson wrote:
Testing on W10 on the latest iteration of this
audacity-win-ra09fcee-2.2.0-alpha-29-may-17

This is much better now that we have the dropdown menu for the selecton
type restored,
thanks for that.

But I really think we need to tidy up the labelling.

a) can we please have the labellin left-justified above each of the two
variable data boxes
(as we had before)

b) Can we have the fuller "Selection Start" as we had before.
And similarly for all the options - ther is no other visual cue in that
"Selection toolbar"
to indicate that it is about "selection"

c) I find the two chevrons "<" and ">" totally meaningless   :-//

But apart from these labelling issues I think the iteration we have
arrived at now is fine.

Cheers,
Peter.


On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 6:28 PM, James Crook [hidden email] wrote:

The prototype you looked at (which attempted to show more than two
fields at a time) has been roundly rejected.  Current head has an update
that never shows 'driven' and that only ever shows two fields at a time.

See if you can figure it out :-)

--James.

On 5/24/2017 6:25 PM, Steve the Fiddle wrote:
I'm purposefully not following the thread about this feature on devel
so that I can try to view it more as user than a developer and give
some hopefully useful feedback.

My initial reaction was: Where's the "Length" gone!

Then I found the "Options".

OK, so that looks useful, but what the heck does "driven" mean?

Poking around and experimenting a bit (which many user's won't do -
they will just be confused)....

So "driven" is a kind of "auto" setting. When a box is marked as
"driven" it is updated automatically when I set one of the other
boxes. I'd not have guessed from the name, though having worked out
what it's doing, I can see that it's being "driven" by the other
settings. I think "auto" would have given me a better clue.

Now if I click on the word "driven", the next box on the right becomes
"driven" instead. I wasn't expecting that, but OK, I see how I can use
that. I'm guess there's a way to change the "driven" item from the
keyboard, but no idea how...

Oh, OK, it changes itself if I type into that box, but how do I know
which will be the new "driven"? Seems a bit of a lottery unless I
explicitly set it with the mouse.

I'll pass on the 4 box option - more complicated than I'll ever need.

Audio Position - OK I can type into it, but no idea why, Doesn't seem
to do anything. Is it broken?

No, please don't tell  me how it works or I'll not be able to give
unbiased feedback.

Steve

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Re: [Audacity-quality] Start / End / Centre / Length

Peter Sampson-2


On Mon, May 29, 2017 at 11:55 AM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
Peter,

It's work in progress.  The title and chevrons are clickable.  The indication that they are clickable is currently missing, and clearly essential.

Now that I've told you that the title and the chevrons are clickable, try them out.

Ahhhhh - cute  :-)))

Some suggestions -

a) why not make the chevron contolled list linera rather than circular.
At the first setting the left chevron would be grayed-out and inoperable,
at the last setting the right chevron would gray out.

b) making them double chevrons "<<" and ">>" might be a possible improvement.
Though maybe a visually stronger icon could help,

c) hover-help (titles and chevrons) would aid discoverability

d) with the clickable titles do you still need the vertical-dots button?
I'm thinking maybe not.

Peter

 

More details, if you want, here in comment #19.
http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1630

There are several possible directions it could go from here.  It's obviously vital that users can see this is clickable, e.g. using button styling.  I am taking on board your comments.

--James.






On 5/29/2017 10:56 AM, Peter Sampson wrote:
Testing on W10 on the latest iteration of this
audacity-win-ra09fcee-2.2.0-alpha-29-may-17

This is much better now that we have the dropdown menu for the selecton
type restored,
thanks for that.

But I really think we need to tidy up the labelling.

a) can we please have the labellin left-justified above each of the two
variable data boxes
(as we had before)

b) Can we have the fuller "Selection Start" as we had before.
And similarly for all the options - ther is no other visual cue in that
"Selection toolbar"
to indicate that it is about "selection"

c) I find the two chevrons "<" and ">" totally meaningless   :-//

But apart from these labelling issues I think the iteration we have
arrived at now is fine.

Cheers,
Peter.


On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 6:28 PM, James Crook [hidden email] wrote:

The prototype you looked at (which attempted to show more than two
fields at a time) has been roundly rejected.  Current head has an update
that never shows 'driven' and that only ever shows two fields at a time.

See if you can figure it out :-)

--James.

On 5/24/2017 6:25 PM, Steve the Fiddle wrote:
I'm purposefully not following the thread about this feature on devel
so that I can try to view it more as user than a developer and give
some hopefully useful feedback.

My initial reaction was: Where's the "Length" gone!

Then I found the "Options".

OK, so that looks useful, but what the heck does "driven" mean?

Poking around and experimenting a bit (which many user's won't do -
they will just be confused)....

So "driven" is a kind of "auto" setting. When a box is marked as
"driven" it is updated automatically when I set one of the other
boxes. I'd not have guessed from the name, though having worked out
what it's doing, I can see that it's being "driven" by the other
settings. I think "auto" would have given me a better clue.

Now if I click on the word "driven", the next box on the right becomes
"driven" instead. I wasn't expecting that, but OK, I see how I can use
that. I'm guess there's a way to change the "driven" item from the
keyboard, but no idea how...

Oh, OK, it changes itself if I type into that box, but how do I know
which will be the new "driven"? Seems a bit of a lottery unless I
explicitly set it with the mouse.

I'll pass on the 4 box option - more complicated than I'll ever need.

Audio Position - OK I can type into it, but no idea why, Doesn't seem
to do anything. Is it broken?

No, please don't tell  me how it works or I'll not be able to give
unbiased feedback.

Steve

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Re: [Audacity-quality] Start / End / Centre / Length

James Crook

On 5/29/2017 12:07 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:

> On Mon, May 29, 2017 at 11:55 AM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Peter,
>>
>> It's work in progress.  The title and chevrons are clickable.  The
>> indication that they are clickable is currently missing, and clearly
>> essential.
>>
>> Now that I've told you that the title and the chevrons are clickable, try
>> them out.
>>
> Ahhhhh - cute  :-)))
>
> Some suggestions -
>
> a) why not make the chevron contolled list linera rather than circular.
> At the first setting the left chevron would be grayed-out and inoperable,
> at the last setting the right chevron would gray out.
I'll think about that and maybe try it out.

> b) making them double chevrons "<<" and ">>" might be a possible
> improvement.
> Though maybe a visually stronger icon could help,
I think the text needs to be in a button, with the arrows each in a
button.  Then it will be clear they are clickable.  The arrows will be
filled triangles rather than chevrons.

> c) hover-help (titles and chevrons) would aid discoverability
+1
> d) with the clickable titles do you still need the vertical-dots button?
> I'm thinking maybe not.
Yes.  That's the idea.
The 'Selection Options' vertical-dots button is a stop gap, re-instated
until the clickable title way works better.

[Btw sorry for switching lists from quality to devel.  I blame my mail
client.  Since we are here now, continuing here.]

--James.



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