Version Checking.

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Version Checking.

James Crook

http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1597


Audacity alpha versions will now open the version-check/download-page on our site, when they are started up.  The version check now passes the current version number, the CommitId (if any) and Build time to the page.

From that information we now can deliver a custom message.  For example, the message for any alpha is currently:


Get a Better Version of Audacity


The version of Audacity you are using is an Alpha version and is not suitable for production use

There will then follow the rest of the download page with the information about the current stable released version, 2.1.2. 

In the script there is a list of versions and messages, and the first match determines the message, so for RC3 we can have a custom message about the status of that version....  The script, showing the current messages, is at:

http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet

Suggestions for changes to the messages can be made on the talk page.


I haven't yet enabled the messages for the download page, but plan to do so once people think this looks essentially OK.




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Re: Version Checking.

Vaughan Johnson-4
Thanks , James!

- V

On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 11:14 AM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:

> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1597
>
>
> Audacity alpha versions will now open the version-check/download-page on our
> site, when they are started up.  The version check now passes the current
> version number, the CommitId (if any) and Build time to the page.
>
> From that information we now can deliver a custom message.  For example, the
> message for any alpha is currently:
>
>
> Get a Better Version of Audacity
>
>
> The version of Audacity you are using is an Alpha version and is not
> suitable for production use
>
>
> There will then follow the rest of the download page with the information
> about the current stable released version, 2.1.2.
>
> In the script there is a list of versions and messages, and the first match
> determines the message, so for RC3 we can have a custom message about the
> status of that version....  The script, showing the current messages, is at:
>
> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet
>
> Suggestions for changes to the messages can be made on the talk page.
>
>
> I haven't yet enabled the messages for the download page, but plan to do so
> once people think this looks essentially OK.
>
>
>
>
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> Check out the vibrant tech community on one of the world's most
> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Re: Version Checking.

David Bailes-3
In reply to this post by James Crook
On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 7:14 PM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:

http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1597


Audacity alpha versions will now open the version-check/download-page on our site, when they are started up.


From an accessibility perspective, it's not ideal to switch the focus to an unexpected window without giving warning. See for example the guidelines for links which open new pages/tabs:

One alternative would be for a dialog to open which gave the user the option to press a button which opened the web page.

David. 

  The version check now passes the current version number, the CommitId (if any) and Build time to the page.

From that information we now can deliver a custom message.  For example, the message for any alpha is currently:


Get a Better Version of Audacity


The version of Audacity you are using is an Alpha version and is not suitable for production use

There will then follow the rest of the download page with the information about the current stable released version, 2.1.2. 

In the script there is a list of versions and messages, and the first match determines the message, so for RC3 we can have a custom message about the status of that version....  The script, showing the current messages, is at:

http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet

Suggestions for changes to the messages can be made on the talk page.


I haven't yet enabled the messages for the download page, but plan to do so once people think this looks essentially OK.




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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
On 2/27/2017 11:03 AM, David Bailes wrote:

> On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 7:14 PM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1597
>>
>>
>> Audacity alpha versions will now open the version-check/download-page on
>> our site, when they are started up.
>>
> >From an accessibility perspective, it's not ideal to switch the focus to an
> unexpected window without giving warning. See for example the guidelines
> for links which open new pages/tabs:
> https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G201.html
>
> One alternative would be for a dialog to open which gave the user the
> option to press a button which opened the web page.
>
> David.
Thanks.  It only affects alphas, and we want to discourage people who
aren't talking with us from using alphas.  YOU can disable it by
choosing to not-show-again the Welcome dialog.  Audacity alphas then
won't invoke the browser either.

We can refine this in 2.2.0 but I think it's an OK compromise.  A 2.2.0
version could have a different sterner welcome dialog (for Alphas) with
a button to go to the website for more information, and I'm even
thinking of having a secret way to dismiss the dialog that only people
in contact with us will know....

---James.


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Re: Version Checking.

Gale
Administrator
It's certainly annoying given it is not obvious how to turn it off.

Will we soon be ready to show "Get a Better Version of Audacity"
above the Download page, so that it makes more sense?

What do we mean by "talking with us"? I think users should be able
to visit http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Nightly_Builds (until we
retire it) and use nightly builds regularly without being in ignorance
of how to turn the behaviour off. I mentioned "how to" on that page,
even if it means the way is not secret.



Gale


On 27 February 2017 at 12:51, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 2/27/2017 11:03 AM, David Bailes wrote:
>> On Sun, Feb 26, 2017 at 7:14 PM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>>> http://bugzilla.audacityteam.org/show_bug.cgi?id=1597
>>>
>>>
>>> Audacity alpha versions will now open the version-check/download-page on
>>> our site, when they are started up.
>>>
>> >From an accessibility perspective, it's not ideal to switch the focus to an
>> unexpected window without giving warning. See for example the guidelines
>> for links which open new pages/tabs:
>> https://www.w3.org/TR/WCAG20-TECHS/G201.html
>>
>> One alternative would be for a dialog to open which gave the user the
>> option to press a button which opened the web page.
>>
>> David.
> Thanks.  It only affects alphas, and we want to discourage people who
> aren't talking with us from using alphas.  YOU can disable it by
> choosing to not-show-again the Welcome dialog.  Audacity alphas then
> won't invoke the browser either.
>
> We can refine this in 2.2.0 but I think it's an OK compromise.  A 2.2.0
> version could have a different sterner welcome dialog (for Alphas) with
> a button to go to the website for more information, and I'm even
> thinking of having a secret way to dismiss the dialog that only people
> in contact with us will know....
>
> ---James.
>
>
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> engaging tech sites, SlashDot.org! http://sdm.link/slashdot
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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
On 2/27/2017 6:37 PM, Gale Andrews wrote:
> It's certainly annoying given it is not obvious how to turn it off.
Sure.  But people who are using the alphas as we intend (downloaded from
us) will know how.

> Will we soon be ready to show "Get a Better Version of Audacity"
> above the Download page, so that it makes more sense?
You tell me.

What do you think of the current messages from
http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet ?

The Alpha would currently show:
http://www.audacityteam.org/slug/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-

You are EIC for WordPress.  Give me the go-ahead and I will add the
scriptlet tag to our download page.

> What do we mean by "talking with us"? I think users should be able
> to visit http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Nightly_Builds (until we
> retire it) and use nightly builds regularly without being in ignorance
> of how to turn the behaviour off. I mentioned "how to" on that page,
> even if it means the way is not secret.
Your choice as doer decides, and curator of Alphas.  Seems a good choice
to me.  People hotlinking may not realise they can do that, and will get
the message every time.

--James.


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Re: Version Checking.

Gale
Administrator
On 27 February 2017 at 19:46, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On 2/27/2017 6:37 PM, Gale Andrews wrote:
>> It's certainly annoying given it is not obvious how to turn it off.
> Sure.  But people who are using the alphas as we intend (downloaded from
> us) will know how.
>
>> Will we soon be ready to show "Get a Better Version of Audacity"
>> above the Download page, so that it makes more sense?
> You tell me.

I thought that was the idea, that the message appears on the
download page. Did I misconstrue?

If I misconstrued, perhaps the messages need a download
link in them?


> What do you think of the current messages from
> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet ?

I had two suggestions I posted yesterday:
http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Talk:Version_Checking_Scriptlet .


> The Alpha would currently show:
> http://www.audacityteam.org/slug/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-
>
> You are EIC for WordPress.  Give me the go-ahead and I will add the
> scriptlet tag to our download page.

At the moment I am one of the two EiC's. I had not thought you
needed EiC permission tor your changes, as I understand them.

It's not easy to define what changes it would be courteous to ask
the EiC's first, but clearly we don't want a permissions logjam.  A
reasonable, informational addition to an existing page should be
deemed as not needing to ask.


Gale


>> What do we mean by "talking with us"? I think users should be able
>> to visit http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Nightly_Builds (until we
>> retire it) and use nightly builds regularly without being in ignorance
>> of how to turn the behaviour off. I mentioned "how to" on that page,
>> even if it means the way is not secret.
> Your choice as doer decides, and curator of Alphas.  Seems a good choice
> to me.  People hotlinking may not realise they can do that, and will get
> the message every time.
>
> --James.
>
>
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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
OK.  It's now live on

http://www.audacityteam.org/download/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-



On 2/27/2017 8:51 PM, Gale Andrews wrote:
> On 27 February 2017 at 19:46, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>> What do you think of the current messages from
>> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet ?
> I had two suggestions I posted yesterday:
> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Talk:Version_Checking_Scriptlet .

Responses on that page.


>
>> The Alpha would currently show:
>> http://www.audacityteam.org/slug/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-
>>
>> You are EIC for WordPress.  Give me the go-ahead and I will add the
>> scriptlet tag to our download page.
> At the moment I am one of the two EiC's. I had not thought you
> needed EiC permission tor your changes, as I understand them.
Ah, OK.

> It's not easy to define what changes it would be courteous to ask
> the EiC's first, but clearly we don't want a permissions logjam.  A
> reasonable, informational addition to an existing page should be
> deemed as not needing to ask.
My concern was that it is a high traffic page, and that you might not
approve of the somewhat confrontational tone of the information
headline: "Get a Better Version of Audacity".

If you need to edit, you can do so by the XYZ-HTML plug-in menu item,
but it is 'code' and if you do more than change text it could break.  
Plus unlike pages, there is no preview.


--James.


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Re: Version Checking.

Gale
Administrator
On 27 February 2017 at 21:33, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
> OK.  It's now live on
>
> http://www.audacityteam.org/download/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-

Thanks.


> On 2/27/2017 8:51 PM, Gale Andrews wrote:
>> On 27 February 2017 at 19:46, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>>
>>> What do you think of the current messages from
>>> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Version_Checking_Scriptlet ?
>> I had two suggestions I posted yesterday:
>> http://wiki.audacityteam.org/wiki/Talk:Version_Checking_Scriptlet .
>
> Responses on that page.
>
>
>>
>>> The Alpha would currently show:
>>> http://www.audacityteam.org/slug/?from_ver=2.0.0-alpha-
>>>
>>> You are EIC for WordPress.  Give me the go-ahead and I will add the
>>> scriptlet tag to our download page.
>> At the moment I am one of the two EiC's. I had not thought you
>> needed EiC permission tor your changes, as I understand them.
> Ah, OK.
>
>> It's not easy to define what changes it would be courteous to ask
>> the EiC's first, but clearly we don't want a permissions logjam.  A
>> reasonable, informational addition to an existing page should be
>> deemed as not needing to ask.
> My concern was that it is a high traffic page, and that you might not
> approve of the somewhat confrontational tone of the information
> headline: "Get a Better Version of Audacity".

It certainly wouldn't have been my choice of wording but I think we
are civil enough to those with old release versions.


> If you need to edit, you can do so by the XYZ-HTML plug-in menu item,
> but it is 'code' and if you do more than change text it could break.
> Plus unlike pages, there is no preview.

OK. I restricted myself to consistency changes - no period at
end of H2, period at end of the following sentences.



Gale

>
>
> --James.
>
>
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Re: Version Checking.

Peter Sampson-2
I jusr tested Bug #1597 commit facaeb9 on W10 and Mac Sierea 10.12.3

On W10
Running this alpha version puts up the Website page (in Microsoft Edge) with the warning.

The warning page appeasrs full screen, no problem with that,
but immediately after it flashes up it is overlaid by the Audacity
Window and welcome mat dialog thus obscuring the information we
are trying to show to the user.

On Mac Sierra
On Mac the Audacity window apperas first and is the oveerlaid with
the Safari window with the warning message clearly displayed

The meassge
I don't think the text is right or good either when it says:
"Get a Better Version of Audacity" the released version that it
steers you to is not necessarily "better" at all.

What it is is a released production version which is fully supported.
I feel we could make that clearer. Stressing the lack of support
should be sufficiently off-putting for whom alpha testing is
inappropriate.

I ran this past my "mystery shopper" (Mrs S) and she is of similar  mind - she said
"It sounds a little peremptort and rude - a bit dismissive - a kinder gentler message
would be better".

Peter

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Re: Version Checking.

Peter Sampson-2
While making some coffee this further thought occurred to me.

We should be using the opportunity of the alpha warning message to advise
what we expect of and need from genuine alpha  testers.

Perhaps we could use the alpha warning message to drive potential alpha
(and RC) testers to a "Tester Recruitment" page in the Website or in the
Wiki where fuller information on testing could be given.

Peter

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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
In reply to this post by Peter Sampson-2
On 2/28/2017 12:19 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:

> I jusr tested Bug #1597 commit facaeb9 on W10 and Mac Sierea 10.12.3
>
> *On W10*
> Running this alpha version puts up the Website page (in Microsoft Edge)
> with the warning.
>
> The warning page appeasrs full screen, no problem with that,
>
> but immediately after it flashes up it is overlaid by the Audacity
> Window and welcome mat dialog thus obscuring the information we
> are trying to show to the user.
Yep.  But it is still there, and the user WILL become aware of it.
Given the intent of the warning, I'm OK with that.


> *On Mac Sierra*
> On Mac the Audacity window apperas first and is the oveerlaid with
> the Safari window with the warning message clearly displayed
>
>
> The meassge
> I don't think the text is right or good either when it says:
> "Get a Better Version of Audacity" the released version that it
> steers you to is not necessarily "better" at all.
Wording can be changed.   'Get an Official, Released Version of Audacity' ??

> What it is is a released production version which is fully supported.

> I feel we could make that clearer. Stressing the lack of support
> should be sufficiently off-putting for whom alpha testing is
> inappropriate.
>
> I ran this past my "mystery shopper" (Mrs S) and she is of similar  mind -
> she said
> "It sounds a little peremptort and rude - a bit dismissive - a kinder
> gentler message
> would be better".
So suggest some kinder gentler wording...

--James.


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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
In reply to this post by Peter Sampson-2
I think that would be good too.  We do not need to open the downloads
page for an alpha, but could instead open the page you suggest.
--James.


On 2/28/2017 12:45 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:

> While making some coffee this further thought occurred to me.
>
> We should be using the opportunity of the alpha warning message to advise
> what we expect of and need from genuine alpha  testers.
>
> Perhaps we could use the alpha warning message to drive potential alpha
> (and RC) testers to a "Tester Recruitment" page in the Website or in the
> Wiki where fuller information on testing could be given.
>
> Peter


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Re: Version Checking.

David Bailes-3
In reply to this post by James Crook
On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 12:54 PM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
On 2/28/2017 12:19 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:
> I jusr tested Bug #1597 commit facaeb9 on W10 and Mac Sierea 10.12.3
>
> *On W10*
> Running this alpha version puts up the Website page (in Microsoft Edge)
> with the warning.
>
> The warning page appeasrs full screen, no problem with that,
>
> but immediately after it flashes up it is overlaid by the Audacity
> Window and welcome mat dialog thus obscuring the information we
> are trying to show to the user.
Yep.  But it is still there, and the user WILL become aware of it.

The welcome dialog is the focus, even if the browser is in front of it.
Whether the browser is in front of behind, a screen reader user will not be aware that it has opened.

Even if the browser becomes the focus, I think many screen readers will not understand why they have been taken to a web page, and so will be unsure what to do next.

David.
 
Given the intent of the warning, I'm OK with that.


> *On Mac Sierra*
> On Mac the Audacity window apperas first and is the oveerlaid with
> the Safari window with the warning message clearly displayed
>
>
> The meassge
> I don't think the text is right or good either when it says:
> "Get a Better Version of Audacity" the released version that it
> steers you to is not necessarily "better" at all.
Wording can be changed.   'Get an Official, Released Version of Audacity' ??

> What it is is a released production version which is fully supported.

> I feel we could make that clearer. Stressing the lack of support
> should be sufficiently off-putting for whom alpha testing is
> inappropriate.
>
> I ran this past my "mystery shopper" (Mrs S) and she is of similar  mind -
> she said
> "It sounds a little peremptort and rude - a bit dismissive - a kinder
> gentler message
> would be better".
So suggest some kinder gentler wording...

--James.


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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
On 2/28/2017 1:28 PM, David Bailes wrote:
> The welcome dialog is the focus, even if the browser is in front of it.
> Whether the browser is in front of behind, a screen reader user will not be
> aware that it has opened.
>
> Even if the browser becomes the focus, I think many screen readers will not
> understand why they have been taken to a web page, and so will be unsure
> what to do next.
Thanks for the information.
That all seems OK to me.

The feature should still cut down significantly on users thinking alphas
are release versions - a mistake that softpedia hotlinking to our alphas
encourages.

--James.



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Re: Version Checking.

Peter Sampson-2
In reply to this post by James Crook
James wrote:
>So suggest some kinder gentler wording...

we jointly worked on this and came up with:

Get the Official Released Version of Audacity

 

The version of Audacity you are using is an Alpha test version.
We strongly recommend that you use our latest stable released version,

which has full documentation and support.

 

If you are interested in becoming an Alpha and Release Candidate tester
please go [here]. <link to Tester Recruitment page>

Cheers,
Peter.

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Re: Version Checking.

Peter Sampson-2
In reply to this post by James Crook
James wrote:
>The feature should still cut down significantly on users thinking alphas
>are release versions - a mistake that softpedia hotlinking to our alphas
>encourages.

+1

Peter

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Re: Version Checking.

James Crook
In reply to this post by Peter Sampson-2
I like it.
I updated the message.

I left off the last paragraph, as we do not currently have a tester
recruitment page.
When we do have a tester recruitment page, for alphas we should open the
tester recruitment page directly, and that explains about alphas and how
we use them, and that page has a link back to downloads.  Better than
opening the downloads page, methinks.

--James.

On 2/28/2017 2:11 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:

> James wrote:
>> So suggest some kinder gentler wording...
> we jointly worked on this and came up with:
>
> Get the Official Released Version of Audacity
>
>
> The version of Audacity you are using is an Alpha test version.
> We strongly recommend that you use our latest stable released version,
> which has full documentation and support.
>
>
> If you are interested in becoming an Alpha and Release Candidate tester
> please go [*here*].
>
> *<link to Tester Recruitment page>*
> Cheers,
> Peter.


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Re: Version Checking.

Peter Sampson-2
James wrote:
>When we do have a tester recruitment page, for alphas we should open the
>tester recruitment page directly, and that explains about alphas and how
>we use them, and that page has a link back to downloads.  Better than
>opening the downloads page, methinks.

+1

Precisely my intention from this alpha warning message.

Don't forget that by the time the user sees this message they will already have
dowloaded an alpha nd just launched it - so to go to the alpha download page
would be inappropriate.

Peter.

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Re: Version Checking.

Gale
Administrator
In reply to this post by David Bailes-3
In my tests on Windows 10 (browser already running or not), the
problem of Audacity being on top only occurs with IE and Edge,
and not with Chrome or Firefox.

I assumed the point of the rudeness and opening the browser was
deliberate, to shock the hotlinkers, so I was prepared to live with it
temporarily. Those who obtain alphas via our Nightly Builds page
can find out how to turn the new behaviour off.

I still think overall, the practice of auto-opening the browser is
annoying, unexpected and smacks of pushiness. Our Welcome
Screen text isn't really appropriate to alphas - the "documentation"
and "support" is overplayed, but what we want from testers is not
mentioned at all. At the same time the browser message - even if
you self-initiate it from Help or "About" dialogue - is contradictory
and unhelpful for real testers. The message should contain help
for them too.

I strongly recommend any "shock" notices for alphas should be
changed to being inside Audacity after 2.1.3 is out.

Either we have an actual separate dialogue you can turn off which
says this is not a production version and has a "Click here" button
which goes to the browser message.

OR put that message prominently in a bordered box in an alpha
Welcome Screen tailored to the requirements of an alpha.



Gale


On 28 February 2017 at 13:28, David Bailes <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Feb 28, 2017 at 12:54 PM, James Crook <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> On 2/28/2017 12:19 PM, Peter Sampson wrote:
>> > I jusr tested Bug #1597 commit facaeb9 on W10 and Mac Sierea 10.12.3
>> >
>> > *On W10*
>> > Running this alpha version puts up the Website page (in Microsoft Edge)
>> > with the warning.
>> >
>> > The warning page appeasrs full screen, no problem with that,
>> >
>> > but immediately after it flashes up it is overlaid by the Audacity
>> > Window and welcome mat dialog thus obscuring the information we
>> > are trying to show to the user.
>> Yep.  But it is still there, and the user WILL become aware of it.
>
>
> The welcome dialog is the focus, even if the browser is in front of it.
> Whether the browser is in front of behind, a screen reader user will not be
> aware that it has opened.
>
> Even if the browser becomes the focus, I think many screen readers will not
> understand why they have been taken to a web page, and so will be unsure
> what to do next.
>
> David.
>
>>
>> Given the intent of the warning, I'm OK with that.
>>
>>
>> > *On Mac Sierra*
>> > On Mac the Audacity window apperas first and is the oveerlaid with
>> > the Safari window with the warning message clearly displayed
>> >
>> >
>> > The meassge
>> > I don't think the text is right or good either when it says:
>> > "Get a Better Version of Audacity" the released version that it
>> > steers you to is not necessarily "better" at all.
>> Wording can be changed.   'Get an Official, Released Version of Audacity'
>> ??
>>
>> > What it is is a released production version which is fully supported.
>>
>> > I feel we could make that clearer. Stressing the lack of support
>> > should be sufficiently off-putting for whom alpha testing is
>> > inappropriate.
>> >
>> > I ran this past my "mystery shopper" (Mrs S) and she is of similar  mind
>> > -
>> > she said
>> > "It sounds a little peremptort and rude - a bit dismissive - a kinder
>> > gentler message
>> > would be better".
>> So suggest some kinder gentler wording...
>>
>> --James.
>>
>>
>>
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